doc
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Post by doc on Mar 31, 2011 17:59:44 GMT -5
Just to be clear (and to get into semantics....ugh ). I have not read the newsletter mentioned that had a list of various SDs. I dont know where 204 "ranks exactly" on a list (that I havent seen). I will say this: one can make a statement that "204 is the second from the bottom' on some list. Or, one can present the real data like I did. I hope the latter method is more informative in the end! of of course you could do the homework necessary to get that information since people regularly quote Curt and Alka- to understand what it is they are quoting -so I'll give you the 'real data' from their stuff in the vein of being more informative.Seriously if peopl are going to stand by their candidates- they should actually know what the candidates are saying.. The schools Curt and Alka use are the following with ACT score and avg daily attendance and class size: Batavia – 22.9, ?, ? St. Charles – 23.6. 95%, 21.4 D204 – 23.9. 94.9%, 23.5 Elmhurst – 24.1, 95.4%, 23.4 Geneva – 24.2, 95.5%, 21.8 Wheaton – 24.4, 95.1%, 20 Barrington – 24.4, 95.1%, 21.9 D203 – 25.0, 96.1%, 21.9 Of course you haven't seen the newsletter but it is ok for Curt and Alka to quote just those schools to make their argument on the 26% lower OEPP- because we have just super communication and transparency right now- according to our leaders and those who give them high marks on the surveys even though they may not know what is really being used to quote findings. But if we are to compare ACT scores and OEPP with the same schools that Curt and Alka use....well, in that case we NEED to use all the schools in DuPage County. Once again not comparing apples to apples
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doc
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Post by doc on Mar 31, 2011 18:04:17 GMT -5
Just to be clear (and to get into semantics....ugh ). I have not read the newsletter mentioned that had a list of various SDs. I dont know where 204 "ranks exactly" on a list (that I havent seen). I will say this: one can make a statement that "204 is the second from the bottom' on some list. Or, one can present the real data like I did. I hope the latter method is more informative in the end! of of course you could do the homework necessary to get that information since people regularly quote Curt and Alka- to understand what it is they are quoting -so I'll give you the 'real data' from their stuff in the vein of being more informative.Seriously if people are going to stand by their candidates- they should actually know what the candidates are saying.. The schools Curt and Alka use are the following with ACT score and avg daily attendance and class size: Batavia – 22.9, ?, ? St. Charles – 23.6. 95%, 21.4 D204 – 23.9. 94.9%, 23.5 Elmhurst – 24.1, 95.4%, 23.4 Geneva – 24.2, 95.5%, 21.8 Wheaton – 24.4, 95.1%, 20 Barrington – 24.4, 95.1%, 21.9 D203 – 25.0, 96.1%, 21.9 Of course you haven't seen the newsletter but it is ok for Curt and Alka to quote just those schools to make their argument on the 26% lower OEPP- because we have just super communication and transparency right now- according to our leaders and those who give them high marks on the surveys even though they may not know what is really being used to quote findings. But if we are to compare ACT scores and OEPP with the same schools that Curt and Alka use....well, in that case we NEED to use all the schools in DuPage County. Once again not comparing apples to apples wouldn't it be easier to just check with those one supports to find out what they used - seems that way to me
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doc
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Post by doc on Mar 31, 2011 18:14:38 GMT -5
Seriously GD- Curt and pals need to decide what ONE SET of data they want to use..maybe they can smoke this stuff by most people who don't read it anyway, but others do:
I wish they would make up their mind which data they want to use. One set of schools for OEPP and one set of schools for ACT. Ok so let’s use the data the district used in the Fall Newsletter 2010 (http://www.ipsd.org/Uploads/news_30931_1.pdf) which compares our district to the following districts regarding Operating Expenditures Per Student, in which we were so proud of. Those schools are and their ACT scores: Batavia – 22.9 St. Charles – 23.6 D204 – 23.9 Elmhurst – 24.1 Geneva – 24.2 Wheaton – 24.4 Barrington – 24.4 D203 – 25.0 If IPSD is going to use these schools to calculate OEPP than we should use the same schools for ACT scores, right? In that case we are 2nd lowest in OEPP and we are 3rd lowest in ACT scores. I’m really having a problem switching the schools based on which area you want to make IPSD appear favorable. You can spin the numbers any way you want to make us look good, but let’s stick with the same schools for different arguments, it would be most helpful. If you want to show areas that IPSD does well I welcome that, but let’s also show areas that IPSD may not do so well. Much like Dave Holm’s budget forecast on March 7th which was based on only favorable things and assumptions instead of being realistic with the community. Eventually you need to take off the rosey glasses and face the facts.
you can't just pick and choose what sets of data you want for each piece- except in 204 I guess
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Post by gatordog on Apr 1, 2011 22:59:53 GMT -5
I have deleted now two posts. Lets stay on topic.
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Post by gatordog on Apr 1, 2011 23:07:48 GMT -5
.....need to decide what ONE SET of data they want to use..maybe they can smoke this stuff by most people who don't read it anyway, but others do: In the real world, rarely is there one exclusive set of data. Maybe lawyers and judges and accountants can get things down to one set of data (that is about the only exceptions i can think of?). I am not trying to win a debate here. I am trying to offer further information, so we can better understand. And this is information that is readily available, clearly and directly to any of us. I dont have to ask anybody to give it to me. Since this discussion is in a voting thread, I want to ask: What is all this about ACT scores? Is this an issue to the voters? What point are you trying to make? I heard all five candidates running say wonderful things about the education that is being delivered to the students. I have not heard one candidate bring up "low ACT scores" as a main issue. This gets back to where I started in replying to this thread: a statement was made about Operations & Maintenance expenditures compared to Debt. The first post here offered a "data set" of only one SD example. Another poster asked....how does this compare to others? Well, I added further data on that. Its not me who is picking and choosing. This forum is open to anybody to add more data, if they choose (Pun INTENDED, )
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Post by steckdad on Apr 4, 2011 23:33:52 GMT -5
It's not that you don't look at your tax bill and get upset....of course we would all like to pay less taxes...Most understand that your only recourse is to move somewhere with lower taxes. gnashing of teeth and hand ringing gets you nowhere...kind of like hitting yourself in the head with a hammer because you have a headache..... what gives me a headache is people who quote no one can make a difference - and continue to hand over more and more money to the same people who pissed away everything they had- and more. THAT gives me a headache.. are we all sheeple, or do we have minds of our own? I will gladly shake your hand the day that one of your "actions" is reflected in a lower tax bill for myself
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doc
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Post by doc on Apr 5, 2011 13:31:42 GMT -5
what gives me a headache is people who quote no one can make a difference - and continue to hand over more and more money to the same people who pissed away everything they had- and more. THAT gives me a headache.. are we all sheeple, or do we have minds of our own? I will gladly shake your hand the day that one of your "actions" is reflected in a lower tax bill for myself going to be very difficult when people like yourself keep supporting people that believe overrunning a referendum by $20M is just fine
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Post by steckdad on Apr 5, 2011 20:57:21 GMT -5
I will gladly shake your hand the day that one of your "actions" is reflected in a lower tax bill for myself going to be very difficult when people like yourself keep supporting people that believe overrunning a referendum by $20M is just fine you have always mistaken my criticism of you and your pals as supporting the SB...and that is not really the case....sorry off topic group
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doc
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Post by doc on Apr 5, 2011 21:58:42 GMT -5
going to be very difficult when people like yourself keep supporting people that believe overrunning a referendum by $20M is just fine you have always mistaken my criticism of you and your pals as supporting the SB...and that is not really the case....sorry off topic group fine, I've not seen any support from you for other SB members - but I'm in a good mood tonite, we'll change the comment to remove 'like yourself'
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